[Solved] Licensing of macro exchanges between individuals where money may be involved

LinerSeven

LinerSeven

Active member
Hi,

Please allow me to confirm about macro transactions between individuals where money is involved.

I believe that MacroDroid should be used with a minimum of "dignity" basically,
the exchange and distribution of macros should be free of charge,
but are there any precautions regarding licensing when money is received in a person-to-person exchange?


What we are concerned about is,
for example,
"Thanks for making the macro,
I'll pay you for it!" case.

Donuts and pizza may be the consideration,
but inevitably, it is a case where money is involved.


I think simply as follows;
If it is "Reward" : 'Normal' License (may be: Purring...)
If it is "Charge" : 'Commercial' License Or **Prohibited**

Is the above understanding correct?

Best Regards,
Liner Seven,
 
LinerSeven

LinerSeven

Active member
Jacob L said:
On the forum (and in some cases on other platformsike WhatsApp and Telegram) we are volunteers and don't expect money. If somebody wants to pay me, I tell hem to donate to MacroDroid. People should not be charging for macros really.

@MacroDroidDev
Click to expand...
Hi, @Jacob L ,

Thanks for your response.
I agree that we should not be compensated for our macros.

Others may think this is an unnecessary topic.

On the other hand,
does the forum also discourage the practice of getting paid for lecturing (e.g. on Udemy) on how to utilise Macrodroid?

Best Regards,
Liner Seven,
 
H

hsurB

Well-known member
I agree with most that was said here. Here we should focus on learning people how to do things themselves and explain things. Sometimes showing some simple macros already prepared is fine as it might be quicker and people should get general idea of how does it work just by looking at it.
Don't get me wrong - I am helping only here and I do it for free as part of my gratitude for macrodroid.
Although I can't fully agree that taking money for creating macros is a bad thing.
There are people that refuse to learn how macrodroid works and they have few choices - pay someone that will do it for them and never create the macro (since they won't 'waste time' learning app).
Usually these macros are complicated and preparing them takes time (it might be minutes but probably even hours in some cases).
Would you guys be fine spending your time to do it for free? (For someone who simply doesn't care)
I believe free version is annoying enough (I am not sure since I've never really used it) that if someone is ready to buy a macro, he will buy full version that isn't too expensive as well. Just to make sure everything works and its not too annoying to live with it.
In the end it should be +1 to macrodroid's users. Potencially +1 to users that have pro version as well. And someone who bought the macro might get interested in the app, change his mind and start thinking about creating more and more of them - maybe without paying now.

And I am sure forum discourage from that behaviour since someone was banned for offering his services not that long ago.
And I know macrodroid isn't desperatly looking for users.
I just think that it isn't the worst thing ever in the end
 
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LinerSeven

LinerSeven

Active member
I am aware that this is a difficult debate because it is tantamount to the question of how to view secondary distribution as a culture.

Best Regards,
Liner Seven,
 
S

sampleuserhere

Active member
They put in the work for someone else, that's fair enough if someone else wants to charge for the hard work they are doing or the other party is willing to pay for someone else's effort and time.

IMHO, such transactional act shouldn't be completely banned in the forum. Open a dedicated subforum and ban any engagement on such topic outside the subforum, the discussion then can be done via conversation so others won't be able to join in the deal.
 
D

Dimlos

Well-known member
Is there an official statement from @MacroDroidDev on this question?
I'm not trying to make money, but I think some guidelines are necessary.
 
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MacroDroidDev

MacroDroidDev

Administrator
Staff member
In general I want the forum to be fully open, searchable and useful to everyone. So lots of posts where people are asking for macros to be built or offering to build macros for a fee are against the spirit of the forum.

I would potentially consider a board where this sort of thing could be discussed, however there would need to be a disclaimer that any payments made or macros developed are at the individuals own risk and that I will not be responsible for any disputes that arise etc. I don't want to end up having loads of disgruntled people on this forum who then go on to cause other problems (which I believe is a risk).

I'm happy to hear many people's opinions on this and will take any next steps once I have heard from people.
 
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D

Dm114

Well-known member
MacroDroidDev said:
In general I don't want the forum to be fully open, searchable and useful to everyone. So lots of posts where people are asking for macros to be built or offering to build macros for a fee are against the spirit of the forum.

I would potentially consider a board where this sort of thing could be discussed, however there would need to be a disclaimer that any payments made or macros developed are at the individuals own risk and that I will not be responsible for any disputes that arise etc. I don't want to end up having loads of disgruntled people on this forum who then go on to cause other problems (which I believe is a risk).

I'm happy to hear many people's opinions on this and will take any next steps once I have heard from people.
Click to expand...
As MD is not made for commercial purpose, due to the really light timelife fee to get Pro version, I feel it would be quite unfair to make business (money) with such a "nearly free" tool which is regularly updated and enhanced with new features.

To make business, there should be a periodical fee (every month/3 month or every year) to support development.
 
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Jacob L

Jacob L

Moderator (Lawsonator)
MacroDroidDev said:
In general I don't want the forum to be fully open, searchable and useful to everyone. So lots of posts where people are asking for macros to be built or offering to build macros for a fee are against the spirit of the forum.

I would potentially consider a board where this sort of thing could be discussed, however there would need to be a disclaimer that any payments made or macros developed are at the individuals own risk and that I will not be responsible for any disputes that arise etc. I don't want to end up having loads of disgruntled people on this forum who then go on to cause other problems (which I believe is a risk).

I'm happy to hear many people's opinions on this and will take any next steps once I have heard from people.
Click to expand...
Is there a typo? You don't want the forum open, searchable and useful?
 
LinerSeven

LinerSeven

Active member
Jacob L said:
Is there a typo? You don't want the forum open, searchable and useful?
Click to expand...
Hi, @Jacob L and all,

Please believe me that my subject is not the receipt of money on the forum.

The subject is about the secondary distribution of your macros, with an emphasis on licensing when money is involved.

Naturally, I also believe that topics related to the collection of money should not be discussed in the forum.

The issue is that "if you exchange money behind the scenes, you are on your own and you should use the appropriate licence".

Best Regards,
Liner Seven,
 
LinerSeven

LinerSeven

Active member
Simple,

'I'll buy a beer for this macro donor.'
'Buy fish and chips to the provider of this macro usage'.

is Good for the culture,

However,
I think the core of the topic is whether providers are allowed to "exchange money" under a normal licence, or whether that itself is officially recognised as part of the Macrodroid culture.

I think you get the idea.
Even if it's officially not allowed, there are people who sneak around behind the scenes.
Currently there are hardly any culture grounding statements.

Best Regards,
Liner Seven,
 
S

sampleuserhere

Active member
MacroDroidDev said:
I would potentially consider a board where this sort of thing could be discussed, however there would need to be a disclaimer that any payments made or macros developed are at the individuals own risk and that I will not be responsible for any disputes that arise etc. I don't want to end up having loads of disgruntled people on this forum who then go on to cause other problems (which I believe is a risk).
Click to expand...

If the board were opened in the future, I would also like to suggest that the threads over there should be limited to two type of post.
  1. Offering service to create macro.
  2. Asking for a paid service to create macro.
The thread would then get locked automatically and any further discussion should be done via private means. This way everything else doesn't stay in public.

Since everything would be then regulated, it'd justify the necessary to ban people for promoting themselves outside the designated board.

Everything else seems good.
 
LinerSeven

LinerSeven

Active member
Hi, @sampleuserhere,

Thank you for the good ideas.
But I am concerned about splitting the forum. It could divide the community.

I believe that the MacroDroid forum should be about technical topics and help,
and agendas for feature improvements, and avoid financial topics.
The reason for this is that forums (like Linux forums) should be fair to the users,
and any unfairness should be avoided as much as possible.

On the other hand,
a small amount of money should be accepted as compensation for the creator's skill and effort
that went into the macros created in MacroDroid, if it was "properly valued".
It would be a bad dream for business to become a zero-sum game!

This is a new issue that has been recognised as MacroDroid
'comes into continuous use' and an official position on them should be necessary.
And despite MacroDroid being a 'Sell and Forget',
consideration must be given together to the fact that progress and maintenance is ongoing.

Nevertheless, in order to achieve a balance
1. officially deprecating, but accepting, the distribution of macros and technique lectures where money is involved Licensing remains as it is.
2. approve the distribution of macros and technique lectures where money is involved, but this requires the purchase of an additional licence, e.g. a builder-specific licence (buy-out if possible, subscriptions are unbalanced in my opinion). easy to use and cost-effective, so it shouldn't be in the same way as IFTTT).
I believe that it will be either.

What do you all think?
I understand that even if you buy a higher level licence, that doesn't mean you can 'do whatever you want' and that some kind of commitment is needed to avoid outlawing it.

Best Regards,
Liner Seven,
 
MacroDroidDev

MacroDroidDev

Administrator
Staff member
For further clarification, I am fine with people offering secondary (monetized) services such as macro creation (e.g. offering a service on fiverr.com) or Udemy courses on how to use MacroDroid and I don't expect any percentage just because it uses MacroDroid. The one caveat being that none of these services are sanctioned or approved by MacroDroid, so if someone claims this or gives the impression that the service is coming from MacroDroid then this is not ok.

I don't have time to personally offer such services or get involved in overseeing some kind of market for this. So I am happy to let the free market take care of providing such services if there is a demand. I am a firm believer in free enterprise so if someone can find a way to earn some money on the back of my work then I'm all for it (as long as they don't cause harm to MacroDroid in any way).

I'm still undecided if I should add a board for this to the forum or not, or exactly what form this should take.
 
Endercraft

Endercraft

Moderator (& bug finder :D)
MacroDroidDev said:
I'm still undecided if I should add a board for this to the forum or not, or exactly what form this should take.
Click to expand...
I don't think this should be added on this forum, there are not a lot of users who offer paid macro creation and usually the macros are created without the end user learning much while on this forum the user often learns as they are just guided in the right direction instead of directly have the macro created. Some thread on a dedicated platform might be better.
 
LinerSeven

LinerSeven

Active member
Hi. all,

Simplicity,

#Licensing is fine as it is#

1. Don't talk about anything involving money in the forum!
2. Don't restrict money-related interactions, but please do it where there is a proper infrastructure.

Isn't this enough?

I too agree with @Endercraft that there is no need for a dedicated thread.

Best Regards,
Liner Seven,
 
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